Interview:

• Deciding to become an animator:
• Starting the career in Animation with Clair Weeks:
• Experiences at Films Division:
• Working with Norman Mc Laren:
• Starting on his own:
• Ramayana and the collaboration with the Japanese:
• Unfolding of ‘Meena’ Series and evolution of ‘Sara’:
• CG, Classical and Experimental works:
• Training of Animators in India:
• Future of animation in India:

Question: When did you first decide to become an animator? Can you tell me more about your background?

Answer: Actually, Cartooning was my hobby. I used to love to draw cartoons. I had never thought of taking up a career in Animation at that time. There was no career available in Animation at that time. There were just a few handfuls of people who were doing animation on their own by trial and error, by reading books, But there was no animation studio in Bombay. In Madras, Gemini Studio had started some animation. Similarly, Prabhat Studios had started at that time animation projects like Jamboos Kaka, etc. It was quite interesting when Films Division announced. Under the US technical aids program, they received an animation camera, and they were also going to get a Disney animator Clair H Weeks to train some people and set up a proper animation studio. So I had some interest in Cartooning since I always loved animation. I thought I would just go and meet this gentleman who was coming all the way from Disney. And, of course, no hopes of getting in because I was not qualified as an animator. When I showed my Cartoons to Clair Weeks, he liked them, and he said, why you don't join the training program. And suddenly, I found myself in the Films Division in the training program. With Films Division, it was like a chance for me to enter into Animation as a career. Around the same time I was offered by Prasad Productions Madras for heading their animation department in Bombay. I thought it was a good time for getting into the private sector.

In 1972, I set up my own group called Ram Mohan Biographics. We were continuing to use equipment from Prasad. With Clair Weeks at Films Division, I first got the chance to get into animation. I had never hoped or even dreamt of a chance of getting into Animation at that time. Cartooning was my hobby, but even that was not serious. I was a science graduate. When I came to Bombay, the idea was to continue with my Science studies. In fact, I had even signed down for an M.Sc program. But then this happened, and it suddenly changed my career line. Otherwise, I would probably be in some Lab or something.


Question: How did you start your career in Animation with Clair Weeks in 1956?

Answer: Clair Weeks was in India in 1956 under the US Technical Aids Program. The American Government had funded this, even the animation camera, and they also sent the experts from Disney Studio Clair H Weeks to select and train some people in India.
The idea was to set up the cartoons Film unit in the Films Division. Essentially as the Planned Publicity Program. They had just launched the first five-year plan. The Government of India wanted to tell the people what its plans were, what it aims to achieve, and how it's going to benefit. They wanted to set up an awareness program. All the films that we were supposed to make supposedly planned programs. Some of them were interesting; some were not interesting. The subjects were not dramatic or fantastic, but issues like Small savings and Health programs, Fisheries were there. Animation was found to be a useful medium.

But the problem with the Films Division was that everything was dictated by the Government. We had people coming in to supervise us because they were technical experts. Although they were technically very good, there was not that kind of imagination or creativity that was being used. We had good equipment and a camera, but they would kind of constrain what we would do. But technically there was a lot that we could achieve like we had good types of equipment and good materials. At some point, we had people like ‘Bhavnagri’ who came in as an expert and stayed with Films Division for a while. And we had ‘James Beverish’ coming in at that time; we always had a little spurt of creativity. Also, when ‘Pramod Pati’ came in, he was trained in Zinca studio in France, we did some interesting work. But I learned a lot from the training program. I had a lot of opportunities to learn. Though I didn’t have any background in drawing, I am a science graduate.

So I had to start from the basics in storyboards and Character designing. Animation was off course, something that I learned from Clair Weeks. The training objective was mainly ‘Basics in Animation,’ but the emphasis was on cell animation. But I didn’t go into the aspects of ink and paint but storyboards and character designs. I learned a lot while I was there. When Pramod Pati moved out of Cartoons Film Division in 1966, there was some kind of decline, like the scene was not too good, exciting, or evolving.

(“Animation was something that I learned under Clair Weeks”)


Question: Can you share some experiences with people at Films Division like Bhavnagri, Pramod Pati, and James Beverish?

Answer: It was the kind of leadership that they provided. It was not that they were there and doing animation. But they were genuinely interested in animation as a medium. And they would encourage us to try out different mediums and techniques. Pramod Pati, for example, had spent quite some time in Checkoslovakia. He wanted the design aspect to change and become more graphic and more stylized. Because the influence was Disney kind since Clair Weeks was there, so he came and introduced us to different techniques in animation. He had excelled in different techniques of animation like pixelation, live-action and animation, puppets, object animation, cutouts, etc. There were so many ways of doing animation other than usual multi-cell animation. So this was what all these people like Bhavnagri and Pramod Pati had retained.

("It was the kind of leadership that they provided.")


Question: How was Animation used as a useful medium for communicating with people during the 1960s?

Answer: The Government of India had planned five years Planned Publicity Program. The subject like those health programs like keeping your environment clean and keeping the flies away from the homes. Cleanliness was off course one, and then there were issues like Fisheries. How even in small ponds and home growing fish. Fighting Malaria and Family Planning. Since it was dealing with so much diverse audience since it was for small towns, villages all over India. Now, if you take a live person or an actor and make a live-action film, this becomes very much localized. He is either a Maharashtrian or a Punjabi, or a Bengali. Whereas using cartoon characters like a villager or a Sarpanch, he becomes more like an icon. And that was why it was more easily accepted over the country. Only the language had to be dubbed. And hence Animation was more effective. People could connect themselves emotionally to these characters as well.
Animation was only liked by children, and kept them involved was the general attitude. But what happened with Meena was very different. The person who was researching Meena returned and presented us the report and said that the response was tremendous. Not only the children but even it kept the parents involved. UNICEF (United Nations Children's Fund) particularly believes that animation is a powerful medium for communicating social messages and development.


Question: How was it working with Norman Mc Laren? What did you learn from him? Any anecdotes?

Answer: In 1967, there was the ‘World Expo of Animation Cinema’ in Montreol in Canada. I went there on my own to Monterol, and I spent some time with the International films Division Canada. I worked with ‘Norman Mc Laren’ who was there, and that was such a revelation with the kind of medium they used, the approach to animation, and the experiment they did. The National Animation Board of Canada allowed me to spend. After the exposure when I came back to Films Division, I felt even more depressed because we just didn't have that kind of ‘Approach to Animation’. So in the middle of 1968, I decided to leave six weeks, i.e., one and a half months, with Norman Mc Laren to see what kinds of work and experimentation that he was making. I was more on an observation trip to see what is happening around me, look at different things, learn the different techniques and react to what was going on. After this, I decided to start on my own.

(“With Mc Laren I explored and experimented the Techniques of Animation which was like a revelation”)


Question: How did you start on your own?

Co-incidentally, somewhere around the same time, Prasad Productions studios in Madras had acquired an Animation stand, Oxbberry - a very sophisticated Rostrum Camera. They had decided to set up Special Effects Department in Animation. They approached me and asked me if I could take over their department. But since I did not want to move from Bombay to Madras, I told them that if they could bring their equipment to Bombay, I would join. So they brought their equipment here, and Prasad Productions Animation Department was set up in Film Center in Tardeo- Bombay, and I joined them. While joining, I told them that I would be with them only for 3 to 4 years because I wanted to become independent after that. We started off with films like ‘Baap Re Baap’ and got this film called ‘You said it’ on how democracy functions. And we got a series to do of ’Down To Earth’, which won several awards. After that, I decided to set up my own company called Ram Mohan Biographics in 1972. Bhimsain who had left Films Division simultaneously as I did, joined me, and did a film called ‘Harmony’, which was done with cutouts (cutout animation), and by moving them under the camera. At that time Hindi films had just started using Animation. We did some animation sequences for films like ‘Hasina Man Jayegi’, ‘Do aur Do Paanch’, ’Biwi O Biwi’ and songs sequences for films like B.R. Chopra’s ‘Pati Patni Aur Woh’ and Hrushikeah Mukheerji’s ‘Khubsurat’ where (the animation was like the Moon coming down and fish flying some fancy things). ‘Bhuvan Shome’, one of the first films where animation was used for the first time was also done at the same time. Because Prasad Productions was in the Films Center and producers used to come there to get their films developed and processed. They also had access to our department and asked us to do animation for their title sequences, and it was fun doing it.

Then Satyajit Ray came in, and he wanted animation for his film ‘Shatranj Ke Khiladi’. There was a scene in the introductory passage where he wanted to show the Political situation in India at that time when Wajid Ali Shah was the ruler. It was very nice working with him because he knew exactly what he wanted. He wanted the whole group of Britishers in style called- ‘Company drawing’. That was all when I was with Company Prasad Productions.

Then when I started with Ram Mohan Biographics the work was mostly Advertising. We were probably the only ones who had the camera and all the infrastructure. We got a lot of work to in advertising, i.e., Commercials. Though it never grew very big, the staff was never more than 10 to 15 artists. People were reluctant to come into animation as a profession because they thought it was a very small field because there were not many advertising films that were being made, and there was no room for major expansion. So right form from 1972 to 1997 when I finally closed down Ram Mohan Biographics, in the span of 25 years, it hardly grew from 10 -15 people to about 20 to 25 artists. It was very difficult to persuade people to come into animation because they thought there was no challenge in it, and it was a very small field.

Suddenly in the mid-nineties, people saw they were interested in doing contract works and outsourced from abroad. I was approached by Rhony Scruwalla from UTV to join hands. I thought that it was a good idea because I found that at the end of twenty-five years I had reached some kind of dead-end. There was no scope of growing any further because we didn’t have the infrastructure to grow any larger. I thought it was fine, and so we set up what was initially called ‘RM-USL,’  and later it was named ‘UTV Toons’.

Everyone used to go and explore the possibilities of outsourced work. So Rhony and I went to Los Angeles, we visited most of the studios there, including Disney and Fox. What we had that time to show there was some of the commercials I had made at Ram Mohan Biographics. Their quality was pretty good because they were for commercials. They require high quality of work. So we had a pretty good show. We didn’t have a problem getting work. The first job that we got was Oliver Twist’s story where Oliver was a little dog, and all the other characters were also animals like Werin was a wolf, etc. It was interesting to work on those episodes. But then we realized that we did not have enough animators. Almost all the people working with me in RMB were joined here so we had a core group of 25 people. But that was not enough to take up works for continuous outsourced work, and we needed a much larger set-up. Now the only way to expand was to train more people because there was no other way to get people with required skills. hence we started training people. Thus along with our Production program we also set up a Training program. We had six months of training program and then they would take on our production, and they would learn while on production. They would start as inbetweeners and then clean-up artists and animators. Then we started growing. At one point we reached a staff strength of 450, which was huge. But then it was not viable to have so many people on the pay role because the kind of work that came in differed, and it was not the same all the time. So we decided to take people on contract. So the moral is that we went along everywhere in India, but Unfortunately in India everyone wants permanent job, security and life long employment which we could not provide and hence some people retired or left their jobs.

Fortunately, at that time there were other studios that were coming up. There was Toonz in Trivandrum, Esca Toon in Delhi by the Escort people, and in Hyderabad, Bangalore, and Chennai. And these people realized that having had training with UTV Toons they would be able to get job anywhere provided they were willing to travel. So there was no problems getting job. Because anyone who had training experience with our UTV Toons, had no problems getting absorbed anywhere else, that itself was a good qualification for them. So that is how we expanded, and we were doing quite well.

But what happened was in the year 2000 and on there were so many studios that were competing against each other in India. And again, India was competing against China and other countries that were all into the same kind of business. Studios were undercutting each other, trying to work at lower and lower prices which were ultimately unviable. So I felt quite frustrated because my whole idea of joining hands with UTV was initially off course getting more and more works that would keep the company running and give us the opportunity to train more and more people. But once we had a team of trained people we should have taken up Original content, doing our own shows and putting them in the world market or at least in the Indian market. But that was not something that was happening. Because once you get into this group of getting more business/work form abroad earn in dollars that become the temptation, and they don’t go beyond that.

So I finally decided that this was not what I was going to do for the rest of my life. Though there was enough work to do, one thing that I wanted to do was to explore animation further. Working on indigenous animation program with Indian stories and content, Indian characters, and the Indian audience. And another thing was exploring that what 3D can do. It was growing rapidly - CGI. I realized that it was important we should move further. The problem with 2D was obviously that it required a lot of labor, so many people involved, and large space. And the only reason why 2D surviving was cheap labor was available in Asia. So CGI indirectly was the only option that was worth exploring. But the problem was that- one perceived CGI as high subtle imitation, the kinds of movement that were performed. After seeing the films coming out from Pixar, for example, we could see that they were overcoming those barriers, tackling the problems, and making movements that were pretty close to 2D. So I thought that is what we should explore. “The possibility of taking CGI i.e Computer Generated Animation and applying principles of Classical Animation”. And to see how much of that can be achieved the kind of stretch and squash and secondary movement which we take for granted in good 2D classical animation. That same principle can be applied. So I decided to switch over from classical animation to 3D and took over the Chairman of this company- Graphiti. The first thing we did was that people who were already doing hand-drawn classical animation gave them basic and strong training in handling Maya 3D software. And we saw it was very easy; within 3 to 4 weeks, they were able to pick up and handle the software. And the results of animation were much better than the other schools without any background in classical animation. So we have now made a policy to recruit people with experience in classical animation. Then we train them for software like Maya, and we get good results. Of course, there is one very specialized aspect of 3D, like modeling, rigging, textures, and lighting, which are very technical aspects of 3D animation and cannot be done through classical animation. Those are skills that one has to develop independently. But animation as such if you have a good model already designed and already rigged to give it natural movements is the job of a classical animator.“We are exploring - Doing 3D animation and then rendering it as 2D so that it has the look of 2D”

“We have not done anything major in the way how 3D Animation is used abroad only for special effects where you blend special effects animation with Live Action in such a way that you don’t know which is life and which is animation. That is mainly for Terminator, Titanic, and Jurassic Park. That kind of work is yet done, but that is the area we would like to venture into.

(“Working with Satyajit Ray was great because he exactly knew what he wanted”)


Question: What do you think where do the two, i.e., CGI and Classical Animation merge? If they merge, where are the conflicts?

Answer: They are merging quite a bit. Because if you see the new films that have been done both for Disney and Dream works. Disney's 'Treasure' Planet, you can see that Environments are created in 3D, characters are animated in 2D, or can animate a 3D character to look it like 2D and blend it with painted background. So there is now sort of two things coming together in many ways, i.e., 2D and 3D. For example, hand-drawn and hand-painted images are blended with computer-generated imagery rendered to look similar, and so on. Therefore I think a stage will come in the future when it is difficult to differentiate between CGI, i.e., Computer Generated Imagery and Classical hand-drawn animation. Just as today, so much of 3D is blended into live-action in such a way that you can’t make out which is life and which 3D as in the film 'Lord of the Rings'. So all of them are coming together in a composite way.

(“We have not done anything major in the way 3D animation is used abroad”)


Question: Apart from Classical work, what are the Experimental works that you have done?

Answer: Experimental work has been done more in the sense of Design than testing. I don’t know if it is a good thing or a bad thing, but I always have had access to the best of equipments for cell animation. When I was in Films Division, they had an Axme camera, and then there was Oxberry. Then when I went to Prasad productions, Oxberry was right there for me to use. So I never had to think about the innovation of some other technique to develop. Usually, these are done when you have a challenge. Like you have to make films with rigged-up cameras, then you have to start working with materials. But we never had that problem, so we stuck to classical animation using cells and paints. And we had no problem getting imported materials like good cells and colours and so on. So in that respect, I think that all the cells itself are kind of Textures one can get, that we have tried. For example, in ‘You Said It’, we took the drawings and painted them on the cells and we just painted them with white on one side, so it was just that white area and then on the top we used inks of different colours to give washes. So it had that different look. So we have done these kinds of things to get different textures and effects

(“I have had access to the best of equipments for Cell Animation”)


Question: How do you define Classical Animation and Experimental Animation? What is the relation between the two?

Answer: Classical animation is something that has evolved over several decades, and the process has been sort of standardized. In fact, classical animation, particularly when done on a large scale, is done almost in an assembly line in a factory mold where each one does his own little part of the production. And then moving on to the next and the next and the next which is done by the number of people and their style of drawing their skills are so molded that you can’t see the difference between the drawing made by one person and that made by another person. They have to be standardized. That is why they are given a model chart, and everybody practices drawing exactly similarly. It is a group effort where one’s particular individual drawing doesn’t stand out. It is the product of the studio. Of course, the director has control over the overall thing, and the original designer has a lot to contribute. But overall, the final product becomes the product of the studio and becomes standardized.

But in the experimental film, it is usually the work of one individual, and he brings his own personal stands, his own sensibilities to the film. And it is very distinguished that you can make out that this particular director or artist makes it. The tap of his personality which is reflected in his film. Now that kind of thing doesn’t happen on a very large scale. Usually done as experimental and therefore probably get shown in festivals and screening. There is an exploration of both concepts and design as well as techniques. You can innovate new techniques like using oil paint on glass or use sand or some new material that can be manipulated frame by frame. So that is experimental Animation. Some of it may finally end up in commercial use. For example, in CG, most of these small films are initially made as experimental films, “Jerry’s Game” (an old man playing chess with himself) that Pixar made. It was made essentially as an experiment, and it was a part of their research. Finding new ways of modeling characters, particularly characters having wrinkles and clothes that had holes on them and how they could be animated. So the whole purpose of the film was more to handle the workout of the sub-divisions and how they could be manipulated. But they put it into a story, so finally, the story itself turned out so good that it won the Oscar.


Question: Does it mean that Classical Animation kills individual creative talent?

Answer: What happens is it there are two aspects to that kind of animation. There is a purely creative aspect which is the first part of the production process. Some of it is concept, developing the story, screenplay and designing the storyboard, designing the characters and doing inspirational drawings like the kind of layouts and setting the style. All this is very creative, and every individual who works in that set-up has a lot to contribute. But when it comes to the animation process there, it becomes more mechanical. In a sense, you are required to do certain things which are asked of you. This is how the character should look, and you can't even deviate by even one hair or one eyelash where everything is given to you. There it becomes more a discipline. Creative talent is there to the extent of animation in terms of performance, but the director usually dictates it. And it becomes more like an interpretation of what the director has asked you to do. But more than anything else, it becomes a craft, becomes a discipline. And I am not saying that it is anything less than any creative effort. It is equally important to have that; otherwise, you won't have a film. If everyone just did the creative part, then there would be no film.


Question: How did Ramayana work out as a Japanese collaboration?


Answer:  As early as 1984, the Japanese gentleman called the Yugo Sako was interested in producing and making Ramayana. He is a documentary film-maker; he is not an animator. So he began to read about Ramayana, and while he was reading it, he realized that there is a lot of potential with this for animation. And he decided to make an animation for it. But he didn’t want to do it independently; he wanted to do it as a co-production with Indian involvement because he wanted things to be authentic. He came here and met many people and was guided to me, and that’s how we meet, and we decided to work together. We started off with scripting, Pt. Narendra Sharma was there a very good scholar. He started writing the script for us, and by the time we were setting up this co-production. The Government of India said that Ramayana is a very sensitive subject and cannot be depicted as a cartoon character. We tried to insist on them, but they didn't understand. We went on trying and trying for about four years but in vain. So Mr. Sako gave up the idea of a co-production and decided to complete Japanese production. But he wanted me to co-direct and supervise it. So I had to go to Tokyo several times where his office is there. But it took us 2 yrs. From 1992 to 1994 and we completed it. And then again, after completion, we had to market them in India. No one knew about it, and it kept lying on the racks. A couple of times, it was showed on Doordarshan. Good thing that happened to it was when Cartoon Network decided to take it over. Last year and the year before, it was shown on the television between Dasherra and Diwali, and the response was tremendous. Then suddenly came the trend of Vcd’s, DVD and cassettes, etc. as a big boom. But as a theatrical release, nothing happened.

In Tokyo, I used to go and supervise the Designs, Gestures, and performances. For example, they didn’t quite know how the dhoti was worn. They used to draw it like pajamas. So one, we had one gentleman actually demonstrating how to wear a dhoti. For example, when Ram seeks blessings from kaushalya and folds his hands, she also does this in their animation- (folding hands). So we had to tell them something about our culture and our gestures. But it was interesting because it was a new experience and they were willing to learn. But the language was a problem. I always had to speak through an interpreter. But it was easier to make them understand by drawings. It was easier to tell that this is right and that is wrong through drawing.

The Japanese have the right attitude towards animation. They are very meticulous, very fine work, and very disciplined. The studio hours vary from 10.am to 6.pm, everyone used to be on their desk at 10. They used to take their brief and start the work, break for lunch, and work till six. During the day, there used to be no Gappa and chatting. So we used to know how much could be done by the end of the day by the end of the month and how much could be done and by the year how much could be completed. There is one major problem in India that we just don't have that ‘Work Culture’. And that's why I think we haven’t been able to do as well in outsourced work as much as in China. I think China has gone far ahead of us. Even Indonesia, Taiwan, Vietnam, and the Philippines are going ahead of us. We just don't have that work culture. They also have even gone ahead and taught people the English language in their studios. That I think should be a part of one’s education, not just how to draw or animate. But how to work in a group, how to communicate, and how to work with discipline. That I think seriously lacks in India.

(“The Japanese have the right attitude towards Animation”)



Question: What do you think - is it a Japanese Ramayana or Indian Ramayana?

Answer: It is a sort of general Ramayana. We had to take care that the Indian audience is not offended. We didn't do anything that was not looking right, like Ram should not have looked like this or Sita should have been like this that we took care of. But the telling of the story was simplified to a great extent. Because we also wanted even the international audience to understand and appreciate what has happened. So it was generalized. Ultimately, it was animation by a Japanese animator it didn't come out the way an Indian Animator would have done it. Because we know about the subtleties of expressions of our gestures, emotions, and how we express ourselves because the Japanese were not very familiar, they went more by the general storytelling than the deeper connotations.


Question: How did the ‘Meena’ Series unfold, and did ‘Sara’ evolve from the same?


Answer: UNICEF, an organization in Bangladesh, was working on social problems in the country. Their chief Roche Carneige had visited India and wanted to make films based on social issues and problems faced in the country. The main issue in Bangladesh was 'Gender Equality'- the distinction between the girl child and the boy child born in the same family how the girl was ill-treated by not being sent to school and not fed enough healthy food. So when Roche was in India, she approached me to make animation films on those issues. At that time, around 1992, I was with my own company, RMB, with a staff of 10 to 15 artists. I immediately agreed and started to create characters for Meena and her family like her brother, parents, parrot Meetoo, etc.

UNICEF being an international organization for Asian countries, these films were supposed to address countries like Nepal, Bangladesh, India, Sri Lanka, Pakistan, and Maldives. Hence 'Meena' had to look like a general girl who would be identified with these countries. So I did the character designing and made the storyboards. But at that time I had very limited staff and not enough infrastructures. Thus I joined hands with Fil- Cartoons Manila and did the animation series for Meena, which became very successful. The first film I made was 'Count Your Chickens' in 1992, which was shown at Disney Film Festival and it won lots of awards. The second film was then made 'Diving the Mango', which was based on the issue that the girl child was given stale and not enough food compared to the boy. Hence we did a series of 14 episodes for Meena films. Eventually, Meena became so popular that there is not a single person in Bangladesh who doesn't know Meena. But there were not enough funds with Fil Cartoons to continue with the series. So I decided to complete the rest of the Meena series using other means like Flash, for example. Thus, I worked with ‘Future Thoughts’ in Bombay, mainly working for Greeting cards in Flash. I used to give them character drawings, and those people concerted them into film drawings in Flash. The way Future Thoughts handled the Meena episodes in flash was very good. Initially, it was a little difficult, but later it became absolutely amazing. I guided them on the animation and storyboards, and they worked out backgrounds in flash. Thus the remaining episodes of Meena were completed with Future Thoughts using flash. Flash as the software has its own intricacies and limitations. But when used differently, it helps to create beautiful results.

At the same time, I was introduced to UNICEF South Africa, facing problems on other issues like Teenage girl problems. Thus I designed ‘Sara’ for the South African country. Sara dealt with the problems of Adolescent girls in South Africa. A few series were done for the same, some were done here while some were done with Fil Cartoons Manila. This is the story behind ‘Meena’ and ‘Sara’.

(“Meena became so popular that there isn't any child in Bangladesh who doesn’t know Meena”)

Question: How do you develop characters? How do you arrive at a general 'Meena'? How do you boil down to characters?


Answer: Yes, definitely! When I made the character for Meena, We also drew Meena in many different costumes like salwar kameez and lehenga or skirt blouse and shirt, dupatta, etc. And these alternatives were taken to the field and researched and shown. And this particular costume which came to use later, she was sort of generally accepted everywhere. They said yes that the girl from any of our village would look like this. So it was accepted right away everywhere across all the countries. In fact, in all the Meena Films, there is a very strong element of research. Every story was researched. Once the concept was developed, it was taken to the field, and there were focus groups of all kinds. Mixed groups of Boys, girls, little children, and parents and all this feedback was brought back, and it was incorporated into the script. And even after we did the storyboard, it was again tested to see whether we drew the characters, their costumes, the environment, and the housing background. Everything was shown to the people by the focused groups in all the countries, and then we finalized it. So when the film was finally made, there was no problem.

We had to keep the details minimal. It was the most difficult when it came to the women to wear. For men it was easy, we had to show a shirt and a lungi. But when it came to women, it became difficult because if we show wearing a saree she would look Indian or a salwar kameez, she will look Bangladeshi. So, the women always had a scarf like duppata and, most of the time, sitting down with legs folded. Or if the mother had to stand up, we would show children standing before her in order to cover the lower part of the body so that it was not understood if it was a saree or a skirt, etc. We didn't want anyone to comment on whether he or she belongs to a particular country.

We had Pt Narendra Sharma, who was a kind of authority. We used to show him the characters and drawings. With Ram, Laxman, Hanuman, and Sita, we were careful because we didn't want people to get offended because these characters were held in reverence. But for showing these demons and Rakshas, we let the Japanese use their own style because there was liberty there.





Question: Having trained a whole generation of animators in India, how does it feel?

Answer: I have students all over the country like in Bangalore, Bombay, Delhi, Ahmedabad, Chennai, and Hyderabad, etc. And they are now training new students while some are teaching in Institutes others working in Studios. It feels nice to have created the Third generation of Animation in India, and I hope it will grow and expand forever.

(“It feels good to have created the third generation of Animation in India”)


Question: According to you, how Animation should it be taught in India? Should there be any kind of Specialization program?

Answer: I have a feeling that some people are looking at animation only as a career as a job. They want the monthly income just like a telephone operator. For those, we should have like Polytechnics where they are taught in-between, clean-ups and basics of animation. For them, animation is not an art form; it is a dhanda called a business. Its their livelihood. And those people are really needed without them classical animation cannot be done. So there should be two types of Institutes: Polytechnics, which teach these basics of classical animation production at affordable fees and short-term courses. And they are in demand; at least they were in demand. Initially, there was a tremendous demand because they didn’t need designers or storyboard artists, or character designers because they came from abroad. What they want was people who could take those storyboards and design and animate them. Now I know we don't have enough people, and I know how much we had to do when We were in UTV Toons to train these people. To train these people in the beginning and then take them on to productions where they would continue to learn further when they were on jobs.

And then there is the other kind of school where animation is taught along with filmmaking. It's not just animation but animation as just a filmmaking medium. So they should also know about music and sound, and I also feel it is very important for animation students to have a knowledge of World classics literature, in dance, in performance in choreography, in lighting, etc. with all this then he becomes a complete filmmaker with a very broad view in all arts. In fact, animation is one Art in which so many other arts flow in. So it has to be that kind of education for animators, sorry not animators but animation filmmakers. There should be a five-year program, at least four years minimum education program in animation with two years of graduation and two years post-graduation, i.e., specialization. Even in art schools, animation should be taught. Like the other specialization subjects like Topography and Photography, even Animation should be introduced soon after students enter, that is, after foundation level. Students can choose to take animation as a primary subject so that by the end of five years, you learn the skills of animation, and when you enter into the post-graduate school like IDC or NID one can hone his skills further as filmmakers.

(“Animation is an Art-Form which has the fourth dimension in Time. It is Art that is moving” )


Question: Should Animation in India be funded by the Government like IT?

Answer: I wish if the Government would subsidize training in animation. Unfortunately, they don’t realize that there are very special skills that are required for animation. Computer literacy is comparatively higher, but not everyone knows to do good graphics. One might know the software, but the creative aspect of it requires special training in Institutes. Sadly even Art schools do not impart any training in animation. We have been trying to persuade the J.J. School of Arts, but there are no funds. Not even in the Films - FTI Pune. So we are neither here nor there. Not in the Art schools nor even in the Film schools. The only Institute that has done some work for training in animation is NID. Now, IDC is doing better, and I am sure that Shilpa has joined; they are exploring much more, Whereas before, they were doing animation only with simple devices. New avenues have to be opened for 2D and 3D animation. In fact, Animation should be looked upon as an ‘Art-Form’ which has the fourth dimension in Time. It is a very beautiful concept- “Art that is moving’. So it has to be encouraged and practiced because the talent is there in India, and I am happy that people are looking towards it.


Question: What is your vision about the future of animation in India?

Answer:  There is no animation culture in India like the countries in the West. Institutes like NID, J.J. School of Arts, IDC, FTI Pune, Films Division, and TASI should come together and form this. TASI is doing it but on a very small level. There is a lot of potential for the growth of animation in India. Basically, there should be awareness, and people should think differently. The ‘Cartoon’ image of animation from their minds should be taken out. In the western countries, animation is done at different levels- for children and adults. Likewise, it should be in India. There is a lot of potential for original content, but unfortunately, the infrastructure is missing. Whereas countries like China, Korea, Japan, Philippines, Vietnam, and Indonesia have taken over India in this field. For content development, ‘Amar Chitra Kathaein’ did some work, but still, that is not enough. They could have explored much more. Moreover, children in the West read lots of comic books that are not so much practiced in India, which has to be encouraged. Thus this Animation Culture has to be practiced and developed in India.

(“There is no ’Animation Culture’ in India as it is in the West”)


Question: What is your insight about Animation?

Answer: “One reason why animation is useful in India is that when you have animated characters, they become a sort of Generalized. Otherwise, you take a live character who belongs to a particular region. He is either a Keralite or a Bengali or a Punjabi to become associated with one particular region in lifestyle. In Animation the character becomes a sort of generalized. Therefore he becomes an Indian farmer or an Indian fisherman so that animation can cover the entire country.”

(“In Animation the character becomes sort of Generalized”)